Dr. Preston Jones: Mark Massar. You were a Sergeant in the Air Force and you played a role in the aftermath of the Jonestown tragedy in Guyana in 1978. We’ll discuss that. Of course, hundreds of people are involved in the response to the Jonestown incident. Some of the roles are major, some of the roles would not be considered major, but all of them come together and create the story. We’ll talk about your part.
But just the first question is, when you hear the word Jonestown, what’s the first thing that comes to mind?
Mark Massar: Honestly, and it wasn’t in the beginning, but it’s, don’t drink the Kool-Aid. That’s been a real pervasive part of my life.
Jones: That’s the famous phrase.
Massar: And like, it kind of dictates my life in a way, right? That I use it all the time to this day, especially with the politics and whatever. I’m very, acutely, attuned to honesty or truthfulness or anything that applies to don’t drink the Kool-Aid; don’t fall for it.
And so I don’t know whether that’s tied to my Jonestown experience. People take—we take such casual liberties with the truth, right? Especially in today’s politics or whatever, and so I’m always—my friends are sick and tired of that phrase. I have to watch out for you.
Jones: As time goes by, I think a lot of folks don’t know where that phrase comes from. It reminds me—I’d love to talk to somebody. I guess Kool-Aid is still produced. I have no idea, but I’d love to talk to somebody in that business and ask them what they did with that as a marketing thing—as a marketing challenge—because it was actually Flavor Aid. That’s just one of the little things that comes out of it. It would be interesting to actually talk to somebody in that company because they must have had a meeting, you know, about what they were going to do about this, if anything?
Massar: Negative publicity, right? We have nothing to do with it.
Jones: So you were an Air Force Sergeant. And you do play a role stateside. You don’t actually go to Jonestown, but you play a role stateside. Right. So let’s just walk through that. What’s step number one on the way to playing a role in the aftermath of Jonestown with the US Military?
Massar: I don’t know if you want to start from—well, it would have to be, how did I join the Air Force to begin with? Because it all kind of leads into it. I don’t know whether we want to start from there.
Jones: Sure. Why don’t you tell us, before you went to Dover Air Force Base, what your job was?
I’m guessing your job had something to do with why you went, but what was your job in the Air Force?
Massar: Well, I had just turned 18 and I had enrolled and I was in technical school at Sheppard Air Force Base in Wichita Falls. And I was training to be a medic, not a combat medic, but a hospital medic, what we call a bedpan jock.
So, my training was just finishing up, and I had received my assignment; it was going to be to become an immunization specialist at an Air Force base in Ohio, Wright-Patterson. I was all set to go, and I don’t remember exactly the timeline, but just before I was going to leave, they called me and they said that my assignment had been changed and that I was now going to go to Dover, Delaware, to Dover Air Force Base in Delaware.
I didn’t know for sure which one, except I wasn’t going to be an immunization specialist anymore. Now it’s going to be a hospital medic. And I didn’t know what that was; I didn’t know what that entailed, but one thing was the same as the other.
I had never heard of Jonestown and didn’t know anything about it. And so I just—that’s how I ended up at Dover, like a last-second switch.
Jones: Now, is it just coincidental that you were sent to Dover, or was it because the bodies were either there or on their way there from Jonestown?
Massar: I mean the bodies were already there, so I think they saw some extra need to fill a slot for whatever reason. I don’t know if you’ve interviewed a lot of service people, but people get pulled out of service all the time. I don’t know if they were prepared for all the bodies that arrived. I showed up pretty late, actually.
Jones: We’ll talk about that now. So you said you’d never heard of Jonestown? Does that include even a week after the event? I mean, it’s really common that young people just aren’t paying attention to the news.
Massar: Well, I was busy with basic training and then my formal training for tech school. So for those 12 weeks, there was no such thing as TV in my life. So I, even before that, had never heard of Jonestown.
Jones: So when do you remember when you first heard that the base you were going to actually had some connection with this huge event in South America?
Massar: I was there already when I showed up like several days after I arrived. As I recall, I didn’t notice. Even then it didn’t really imprint on me. It didn’t have any meaning. It wasn’t there in my face. It was just something obscure out in the mortuary section.
Jones: So walk us—
Massar: I mean, I’m an 18-year-old kid.
Jones: From that state of blissful ignorance to that moment when you do actually, you’re now physically close to the aftermath. Do you remember that? Do you remember kind of crossing that bridge from that state of blissful ignorance to, wow, okay, this is something pretty big that went down in South America?
Massar: No, unfortunately I don’t. I worked with a lot of people—I was assigned to a barracks to sleep and such. And so, in that particular confine, there were a lot of people who were directly involved. I didn’t know them. I never knew them. They would come and go, you know?
My schedule as a medic working in the hospital was two weeks evenings, two weeks nights, and two weeks days on rotation. So I was always coming and going. In the beginning I didn’t really make any acquaintances, but there was a lot of strange stuff going on, right? The people there were having a very difficult time coping with a number of situations. With service people and coming to the realization that you may have volunteered to go into the service, but you can’t leave. Hotel California. You are stuck there no matter what, and you’re going to do what they tell you to do, whether you like it or not.
A lot of people had big problems with that.
Jones: Because they were being asked to—for lack of a better phrase, process the bodies?
Massar: Yeah.
Jones: And this isn’t what you have in mind when you’re joining the Air Force?
Massar: Right. I really don’t think that they were prepared. I mean, there were a lot of people even in basic training all the way along the line that just couldn’t deal with the fact that they were confined.
Like whatever kind of modern-day slavery you want to equate service to. You can’t escape. And so it definitely hit that, right? A lot of drug use. I didn’t think that that kind of stuff could take place. Just open usage of it and I’m like, but they must have some allowances for what’s going on.
Jones: It’s the post-Vietnam military, right? The post-Vietnam, pre-Reagan military.
I have a recollection of the kind of things that you’re talking about. You go from being a pretty free 18-year-old to being a pretty unfree 18-year-old and everything that comes along with that.
But it sounds like you’re also saying that at Dover, in addition to those challenges that you get with young enlisted military personnel, it sounds like you’re saying an additional challenge was the particular work that some of these guys and gals were involved in processing the bodies from Jonestown.
Do you have a recollection of that? Did that just kind of create a certain kind of spirit, a certain kind of vibe in the place?
Massar: Absolutely. So I mean, I was only at Dover for about a year. And I transferred out and went to another Air Force Base, Bergstrom, which was in Austin, Texas. Now it’s their international airport.
I also stayed in the barracks there. So there was a—I don’t know whether Austin, Texas, probably has something to do with the vibe or the atmosphere or whatever, but it was night and day between the barracks at Dover and the barracks at Bergstrom.
Jones: How would you describe the vibe at Dover when this whole processing thing was going on?
Massar: How would I describe it? I wish I had the perfect adjective. You know, what you see are impressions. Like, it was always overcast. You get in the environment because I showed up in the middle of the winter. I showed up in January of 1979. And in February we had a huge blizzard, like the biggest blizzard it had in 20 years or whatever. And the snow was packed up like halfway up a car.
So it was a very compressed mood. I always equated it with, like, a New York attitude. What was Dover like? Well, Dover has an East coast vibe. East Coast people are duller; they’re strangers. They’re wary of other people; whereas Texas is friendly and open, and there is sunshine.
Jones: What I’m wondering is—so you’re describing the weather and there is that East Coast vibe. Did the connection between Dover and Jonestown make that vibe all the more somber? That’s what I’m trying to get at.
Was there kind of a psychological vibe that there’s this thing going on on base that kind of has people weirded out or something like that? I mean, would you say that that was part of the—we’re using the word vibe—was that part of the vibe in Dover?
Massar: I would definitely say that on those particular occasions, there were occasions—I only really knew one person who was directly involved in it, and so when he would go out there to work and come back home, he would know whether TV cameras had been out there that day. So he would be all excited to see whether he made it on TV or not.
So we would all gather around, and I’m sure there were other people who were involved in this, but I just never got to know them. So the whole dorm room and the whole common area where the TV set was would become crowded with people looking to see who would show up on the news and whether they recognized anybody.
And it’s always seemed to be on a Friday for whatever reason, that the camera crews would do some kind of an update or whatnot. And there was, like, one—it wasn’t every Friday, but there was one occasion where people were like, there’s Jim or there’s Bob, because a lot of people are living off base.
The dormitory is really only for single, unmarried people. And a whole other group of married people for off-base housing and whatnot. So, they would recognize this person who didn’t live in the barracks but lived off base or something.
Jones: You’re saying that the camera crews were there because they were reporting this unfolding story?
Massar: Right. Some kind of an event that occurred out there. Some kind of investigation, then it was the broadcast news. There were only three channels at the time, but it might be ABC or CBS, something like that. And they would come out.
Jones: One of the reasons the bodies are still there—to my understanding is that a lot of the bodies went unclaimed. Because the bodies come in November. You’re there in January and February, but bodies are still unclaimed. There are difficulties finding places to bury them. A lot of cemeteries don’t want to accept bodies.
Massar: The only way to identify a body back then was by dental records or fingerprints. So there was some delay in getting those particular records. First you have to know who was down there. They had all rescinded their US citizenship, and so they could have just been left there.
They were no longer considered US citizens, but we, the US took the time and trouble to bring the bodies back, but, like, whose body belongs to whom? There’s no DNA test that you can do. So I think that some of the reason it dragged on was because we don’t have any dental records to try to match it up with this person because they were all in California. This is all taking place in Delaware. There is no email, no fax. I guess there was—there might not even have been faxes at that time. I think we were still using carbon paper and stuff like that. So I think there’s a little delay and all that stuff you said too.
Jones: Did you ever personally see anything related to that process? The processing of the remains from Jonestown, the coffins, or things like that?
Massar: That’s a tough one. Before I forget, in preparation for meeting you, I was researching you. I looked up whatever information I could and looked up a video that you had done so I’d know your interview style and whatnot. And I saw that there was a mortuary in Dover, Delaware, that closed in 2012, and they found six bodies from Jonestown that hadn’t been identified and had been left in the corner somewhere.
So you can Google that, and you’ll see that it happened at this mortuary. There are probably others, but I didn’t find any articles that updated that. And this is after that whole debacle over Delaware and the mortuary section, where they would just discard parts of bodies that couldn’t be identified.
In general, not just with Jonestown, but army bodies. If all you had was a hand or a finger, there was no way to identify it. They were just throwing it all into one common pile. So there was a huge—so this is after that; they then discovered all these, they were cremations; this body had been cremated from Jonestown.
And I don’t know whether they were identified or not, but at whatever rate, you’ll see that there was a big scandal in Dover and you can see a lot of newspaper articles. I saw nothing on the national news because I’m very attuned to anything I watch that comes out about Jonestown.
Any special, anything, whatever. So, my radar goes off when I hear the word Jonestown or Jim Jones, whatever. And I never knew that until I looked into you. So, I wonder how that isn’t that interesting.
Jones: So you were looking up something related to me, but then that led to this other thing.
Massar: Stuff I had never known about myself.
Jones: And no, I’ve never heard of that either.
Massar: And so you said, did I have any direct connection or?
Jones: Did you personally see things there?
Massar: I want to say I did, but I really, honestly don’t think I did. But when I look into it, it seems like I want to block it out. It’s the weirdest thing. I don’t know. It didn’t affect me. Can we assume that I did? I don’t know whether these memories that I have are false memories or what’s going on with them, but, like my impression, the impressions that I have are a distinct memory of being loaded on a truck early in the morning along with everybody else.
We’re on a special mission. It was kind of a cold day. I want to call it like an army transport carrier. Like, a big truck with the sidewall on it. And we all pile on benches outside. It doesn’t protect us from the weather. And so I remember taking a ride out to somewhere that seemed like an aircraft hanger. Not the mortuary part, but the aircraft hanger. And there we met another truck that had a bunch of metal caskets stacked on it. And our job was simply to take the caskets off of that truck, bring them into this aircraft carrier, and put them next to this stainless steel thing, which I would call it. It wasn’t what you see on TV as far as where they do autopsies or anything.
Nothing permanent. But it was kind of a—and I’ve seen pictures of it. Again, looking into your situation, I ran into these pictures that I—that’s what I seem to remember, but I never looked up before. So like where would I get this impression of this?
And then the most distinct memory that I have is that they would take the—they would open up the casket and the body was contained in a plastic bag. They would take the bag and they would put it on the thing. I remember somehow walking away and hearing a plop and looking back to see that an arm had fallen off of the stretcher part and splattered on the floor. It was black and swollen and nasty. And for some reason, if I saw it, I want to block it out. And if I didn’t see it, it’s like, why am I making it up? Why am I making this story up, right? So it’s a very confusing thing.
I’ve always hoped to find some way to—like the military documents, everything, right? So somewhere there would be a document of me getting onto the troop transport somewhere. There would be a document I was excused from the day for this particular service, right? And that would verify that, oh no, I am blocking this out or no, you made it up. There is no such record, but you know, maybe it’s a collection of stories that other people had told me, right?
This one gentleman that I knew who was actively involved in it, he would come back and tell me things about what he saw and maybe that’s something I want to piece it together. Very weird.
Jones: Well, do you remember anything that he said about what he saw? Do you remember anything that he said?
Massar: Well, the one thing he said that I don’t recall is the particular smell being so bad that day that he had to wear two masks instead of one and it still wasn’t helpful.
So you had these masks that were sprayed with some kind of peppermint to help block the smell. He said one wasn’t enough, and two weren’t enough. I don’t know whether it was a warmer day or whatever, but I distinctly remember that. Whereas I don’t have any recollection of having to wear two masks or any mask at all.
Jones: Now, you were there and we’ll just assume you did this operation this one day. I mean, in addition to the visuals, were any other senses affected? Was there a smell that you picked up as well? .
Massar: Very hyper-attuned to any kind of smell of death. Very sweet and sour smell to me. And, so if I’m walking somewhere and there’s a dead bird or some animal, you know, roadkill, it brings back some kind of—I don’t want to say a false recollection of the smell of what death smells like.
Jones: So when you smell that, that does bring you back to the incident at the base?
Massar: Even little smells. Anything that smells like death will bring back some recollection of my time at Dover. Way beyond just the Jonestown thing like that, working in the hospital, anything like that, it brings back a flood of memories.
Jones: When did you realize—you said that even after the event itself had taken place, you were busy getting into the Air Force, getting your training and all that, and so you didn’t really know what Jonestown was about—at, at what point did you realize that Dover was attached to what actually was a pretty huge story, the biggest suicide homicide in modern history?
Was that later on when you realized that this is actually linked to something really huge, or did you realize that while you were there?
Massar: I realized it while I was there, but not the impact. When you watch your friends or acquaintances on television moving these bodies or you yourself are involved in it, I had no impression of any of that, really. It was many years later that I kind of realized just how impactful that was.
To be honest with you; I might’ve been in the throes of PTSD. I guess that’s what they call it these days, just from my whole period of my enlistment and how I got enlisted. You go through basic training, which, for me, I was Gomer Pyle, and my Sergeant was Hartman. Full Metal Jacket has a lot of meaning to me because I was Gomer Pyle and my Drill Sergeant was an Army Sergeant screaming at me for sneaking a donut in or things like that.
And then, at tech school, I was sexually assaulted. I had a questionable priest and I thought I was witnessing a sexual assault that someone else was committing and actually got thrown in the break for that for a while. So it was a very tumultuous four months.
Have you heard of a Section 86?
Jones: No, I don’t think so.
Massar: That is somebody who had to enlist to avoid a conviction. I was one of those. I went to see a judge and he was like: “either you enlist today or you go to jail.”
Okay, I’ll enlist. Boom, boom. See the judge the next day, enlist the next day, and go to basic training. Six weeks later, go to tech school. Six weeks later, go to Dover, Delaware. I don’t think I’d ever been out of state, only to visit relatives in Wisconsin.
There’s a whole different environment than growing up in Texas. Thrown into the East Coast by myself, having expected to go to Ohio, and so it was a very—I was a little bit out of sorts. So, other people’s problems come second to your own age.
I think I was more involved in my own situation than what happened to a bunch of dead people in Guyana who renounced their citizenship.
Jones: What’s that?
Massar: Who had rescinded their citizenship? They got a big contention about that.
Jones: I haven’t heard that either.
Massar: Oh, really? To go down there, you had to—not the children, of course—but the parents, they all agreed to no longer be US citizens. They were citizens of Guyana. Well, why bother to go get them if they don’t even want to be part of the United States?
And we spent many millions of dollars, time, and effort, and that’s right. I think that’s a great statement of America. We took the time and trouble to go ahead to bring back and identify them and try the best we could to give them a proper burial because they had been under the influence of this madman.
And his underlings. Jim Jones, that’s one thing. But then you have lieutenants, right? Jim Jones can’t do it all himself. He had these lieutenants that no one has barely ever investigated for their particular role. I don’t even want to say carrying out Jim Jones’s role because he was whacked out on drugs as far as I can tell at the end.
His lieutenants who were running the show, managing 900 people—that’s not going to be done by one person alone. There was a cadre of women—was it three or five women that he was, his wife—women that he had slept with and had a couple of sisters, and they were pulling the strings a lot more than him at the end.
Jones: It’s an interesting theme. So, so you said, a little while ago that when something comes up with Jonestown that you—but I didn’t catch exactly. Are you interested in it or you not interested in it?
Massar: I’m very hyperattenuated. I watch it all. I read it all. I look for it. I’ll even rewatch some stuff, partially, to see if there’s any of those news clips that I remember.
ABC news would come out to Dover, Delaware, to film people moving the caskets around. And if you look really hard, you can find a couple of them.
If you Google the web these days, you’ll see some random pictures of people just on duty at Dover, moving a casket from here to there. There was a lot of shuffling going on. The bodies had to have been frozen, which is part of my false memory recollection.
If I’m there in February, I’m charged with the task of going out to help move these caskets so that dental records can be identified. The bodies had to have been frozen, whereas you can’t—they hadn’t been kept in their state all that time since November without some kind of refrigeration process going on.
I don’t know why I would think that the body, the arm, would fall off the body like a piece of meat. It’s all very confusing. But yes, I try to explain to myself what’s going on. Well, I appreciate that.
Jones: Let’s take the worst-case scenario and say that even if this one day the whole thing is a false memory, just for the sake of conversation. It still says something about the impact of this event on someone who was in Dover where this is going on—
Massar: Degrees of separation—
Jones: If nothing else, it does say something about that. Which then gets to the magnitude of the event.
Massar: Definitely. And then, I was sexually assaulted there by someone who may have been profoundly affected by what was going on in Dover.
He was a lot older than me. So I think about my age, just being 18, having a lot to do with it, right? So somebody, as you get older, you seem to see the enormity of the events that are going on around you that I don’t think you kind of grasp when you’re 18. You don’t; you’re too selfish at that particular point.
You don’t really have any kind of aspect. So maybe even, you know. If not for Jonestown, I wouldn’t go to Dover, that’s for sure. If not for Jonestown, maybe I don’t get sexually assaulted. Now, he wasn’t successful, but he just kind of—he got on top of me and I had to beat him off of me, which I was successfully able to do.
But that caused a series of repercussions. So that’s why I was only in Dover for a year. You know, I got out of there and went to Bergstrom.
Jones: So your interpretation is that guy, what he did was a response to his work with the Jonestown thing, that he just kind of freaked out or something?
Massar: No, I don’t know that. He might have had that. I mean, he was sexually—his sexual propensity was for other men to begin with. But he might not have been aware of that. Now, does Jonestown exacerbate that? Does he come to the realization, like, why did he attack me?
There were a lot of crazy things going on. It was all part of the environment. I wish I was explaining myself better right there. So, I want to say, like, the broken window theory.
Have you ever heard of that? So if you’re walking down the street and you see a broken window, then you think it’s okay for you to throw a rock.
So there was a whole—it was okay to do drugs on base. It was okay to do this. It was okay to do that. So in this hedonistic environment, this place has gone crazy. Because I know Dover is a very isolated place. I never visited Dover, the city itself. So you’re on this base; you’re locked in this base.
You don’t really go that way, especially in the winter. You’re kind of locked inside of this dorm room. And so the whole mentality of people affected kind of radiates outwards in a way that you can never detect or even claim. But nonetheless, what is it?
They say that the CEO sets the environment of a corporation. I’m not using the right word, not the environment—
Jones: I get what you’re saying. The tone.
Massar: I think Jonestown kind of had that effect on the barracks that I had.
Jones: It makes sense.
Massar: Coincidental, right? That’s very coincidental that he, whatever, it may have pushed him just a little bit. Like to attack me? It doesn’t make any sense. I never met this guy in my life, so why he chose me at that particular time? You have to find a reason, right? So the only reason that I can come up with is Jonestown.
Jones: May maybe some sense that sort of creates a feeling of psychological instability, which then has repercussions.
Massar: He feels lonely and he wants to be comforted and he picks the wrong way to do it. He feels trapped and he can’t meet somebody that he would like to meet somewhere off base because that’s not really a possibility.
The one guy who had a car went crazy and drove it right into a brick wall. He was my roommate. He seems all right. And then one day he drives his car into a brick wall and he gets discharged. So I get a new roommate.
Jones: This is also Dover, where this guy does this?
Massar: Yeah. He was from Pittsburgh. A real nice guy. He just went off the edge one day.
Jones: So just to wrap up, it sounds to me like what you’re saying is if nothing else, having all of those bodies that come up from Jonestown in Dover create, or at least significantly help to create, an atmosphere there that leads to a lot of problems.
Massar: Absolutely. I don’t think there’s any question about that whatsoever. That’s my main takeaway. I wish I could word it better. Talking out loud is a lot different than ruminating. Right? It helps to kind of—you realize that you’re not providing the correct words and just
Jones: No, no. I’m getting what you’re saying and I really appreciate you taking the time. I think this is an important contribution. Just even just getting information on—we’ve been using the word vibe or just the atmosphere, the tone that exists at this time, and how people are interacting and the impact that it has on individuals. Other stuff is going on, but it’s hard. It’s hard not to think that if you’ve got hundreds of bodies that have come in as a result of something so horrific, including a lot of children, it’s hard to imagine that that’s not going to have a significant impact—
Massar: In a morose environment. Is morose a good word?
Jones: I think a morose environment.
Massar: There was not a lot of joy. There were not a lot of happy people walking around. Everybody seemed to be mentally under the weather. There was a cloud over everyone’s head. And it was only when I got to Bergstrom that there seemed to be sunlight again.
I was like, wow, that’s pretty weird? And that’s in Texas. I blamed it more on the east coast, but now I’m older and I realize that’s an East Coast mentality because things were pretty dire in 1979 on the East Coast. New York was close to bankruptcy and I had never really experienced cold or overcast. I’m used to Texas weather.
That doesn’t explain what I was experiencing among the people that I interacted with. There was something heavy, and it was Jonestown.
Jones: It makes a lot of sense.
Massar: It’s very hard. You could never—a detective could never—you could never get proof on paper. There’s no test, or DNA test, or any kind of objective thing that would prove it. But I think we have enough experience now to know that makes sense. This has been like a counseling session.
I’ll send you the bill later.
Jones: I really appreciate you taking the time. I think this is important. Again for me, the main takeaway is you’ve been describing a certain atmosphere, a certain tone on the base, and what you see is that something that happens thousands of miles away in a little South American country comes to Dover and has an impact on people there.
And here we are more than 40 years later still talking about it. So it’s an important event.
Massar: Living with a false memory, some groupy false memory. It’s like, well, why do I have this? Of all the things to make up? Why do I feel the need to make this up? Or did I make it up? And the whole, you know, hyper-attention to anything to do with Jonestown and my own little conspiracy theories about what “Mother, please, mother please, mother, please” means? Jim Jones is calling that out at the end.
He was calling his wife mother. He was calling other women “mothers.” To my mind, that’s why I’m hyperattenuated. Is somebody going to make that kind of connection or am I just reading too much into it that he was actually thinking that it was the wrong course of action?
He was so drugged out and stupefied that all he could do was cry out, “mother, please, mother, please,” as if. No, no. Stop this. Stop this. And it was actually his cadre that was executing the plan that he had originally constructed. Who knows?
Looking up the thing about the cremations that were found 30 years later in some abandoned Dover mortuary. I think that’s a very interesting thing.
Jones: I’ve never heard of that. Well, Mark, I really appreciate you taking the time thanks for sharing this.
Massar: If I could, I just want to thank you. Because one of the things that is very important to me in my life is the slave diaries that were created by people during the Great Depression. The government went and hired all these journalists to go out and interview people about their slave experiences, and reading those is just so enlightening to me.
And can you imagine if that hadn’t happened? And if we don’t have actual human recollections? God bless you for your work, and I hope someday you find—like in researching you, I found an article about one of the actual aid dentists who were involved in actually doing the dental matches.
I think interviewing him would be very interesting, and the other gentleman knows him and has done stuff on him. You are Preston Jones and who’s the other gentleman that I’ve been working with? Fielding? He knows that guy. He knows how to get in touch with that dentist who was one of the eight who had to—between him and another guy, they were actually responsible for 70% of the bodies—so he would be a very interesting interview. I hope you can get in touch with him.
Jones: I hope so. If you happen to be in touch with anyone that please pass their contact info to me.
Thank you. I was wondering how this would go, like, why me? It seems so insignificant, but God bless you for your work. Good luck.
Jones: I appreciate it. Mark. Thanks very much.
Contextual Notes